Diplomacy Availability Feedback

[pazam-h2]

Preliminary checks

• I've checked that there aren't other open issues on the same topic.

Describe the problem requiring a solution

One reason Diplomacy is often perceived as weak or unreliable is that players frequently don't realize when it would have triggered under different circumstances.

Currently, if a neutral stack is willing to join but the player lacks sufficient gold or does not have a free army slot, the game provides no indication that Diplomacy was actually possible. As a result, many players assume the skill simply isn't activating and may forget it exists altogether.

Describe the possible solution

I suggest displaying a message when a neutral army would have offered to join, but the offer cannot be completed because:

The hero does not have enough gold.
The hero's army is already full.

This would make Diplomacy's effects more visible to players, improve understanding of the skill, and reduce confusion without changing gameplay balance in any way.

Additional info

No response

[ihhub]

Moving it to the Discussion section.

[pazam-h2]

Already made a working PR #10826

Videos for reference:
No room + 5x army strength:

606737686-fbcd7f5c-9304-48f2-998d-329ce10f0155.mp4

Not enough gold + 5x army strength:

606737730-4fb41c77-efca-4361-a6f3-44b8d49c215d.mp4

Not enough gold without run-away:

2026-06-12.02-26-05.mp4

[zenseii]

@Branikolog, how does the visions spell work in this regard? I'm worried that such info could devalue that spell by giving this information, although this information is always possible to deduce.

Personally, I'm not sure this change is strictly necessary. The benefit of increasing player awareness about how diplomacy works, is not good enough to warrant many extra popup dialogs per playthrough for players. IMO popup dialogs should be strived to be kept at a minimum.

Perhaps as a first step it would be better to have a look at the description text of the diplomacy skill instead? I think such information, if we deem them necessary, should be provided there, similar to how you don't get a dialog message saying "Your lightning bolt did half damage due to the enemy hero having the Lightning Helm." every time you cast lightning bolt.

[pazam-h2]

@zenseii -
This idea emerged by me because Diplomacy mechanics are too hidden in the game. So yes, I agree that the popup was maybe overdoing it.
BUT, unlike other ideas I had to add info ingame that I dropped, this one warrants some kind of a change.

Diplomacy is way too misunderstood in H2 for no particular reason.
I'm not sure though if extended info in the Diplomacy skill would be a good fix, as it's already very long.

[pazam-h2]

I gave some thought to alternative approaches, including showing Diplomacy-related information in the neutral army right-click window instead of using a popup.

However, the more I looked into it, the less convinced I became. If the information is only shown in blocked cases, it feels inconsistent. If it is shown all the time, it starts exposing hidden Diplomacy mechanics and adds information many players may not care about.
Also, it is too intrusive and 99% of times will be useless info onto a very used and simple dialog.

So at this point, I still think there is a real UX issue here, but I agree that my proposed popup solution may not be the right way to address it.

[Branikolog]

I have mixed feelings about this proposal.

On one hand, providing the player with more detailed feedback about how the Diplomacy skill works is generally a good idea and fits the spirit of the project. However, on the other hand, introducing additional messages every time the skill is triggered may be perceived by experienced players as unnecessary noise or even a distraction.

My main concern against the proposed change is that it may not reliably represent the actual probability of joining in certain situations. In cases where the hero has a full army, the message cannot accurately reflect the true chance of neutral creatures joining, since successful recruitment depends on having an available army slot. This means the player would need to dismiss one of their stacks first, which itself changes the underlying probability.

As a result, seeing a message on approaching to neutral monsters stating that creatures were willing to join a full army could easily lead to a misleading interpretation of the situation. After freeing a slot and retrying the same encounter, the player might then observe that the creatures no longer agree to join. This creates an inconsistency between the displayed message and the actual game mechanics, since the true chance depends on the hero’s army strength and composition at the moment of interaction.

Additionally, revealing too much information about the exact chance of joining could reduce the usefulness of the Visions spell, which is intended to provide an information about such outcomes. In general, I believe the exact formulas and precise probabilities should remain hidden from the player, who should instead rely on approximate intuition and experience.

Diplomacy is already a very powerful mechanic, and providing additional pre-encounter or near-explicit information about recruitment chances could further strengthen it beyond its intended balance.

Overall, I am comfortable with the current implementation of Diplomacy. I believe it is better not to expose players to extra, potentially misleading or distracting information. At most, expanding the description to clarify key constraints—such as the requirement for an available army slot—could be a reasonable compromise.

[pazam-h2]

@Branikolog -

I agree with most of your concerns regarding my proposed implementation. In particular, I agree that showing information about a potential join offer when the hero has a full army can be misleading, since changing the army composition may also change the outcome.

That said, I still think there is a UX issue in the current implementation of Diplomacy.

My concern is not about exposing exact formulas or probabilities. Rather, it is that there are situations where Diplomacy is relevant to the encounter, yet the player receives no indication of that whatsoever. As a result, many players end up misunderstanding how the skill works or forgetting about it entirely.

At this point I agree that the popup solution is probably not the right approach, but I am still not convinced that doing nothing is the best solution either. I think there is room for some improvement, whether through the skill description or some other less intrusive method.

[Branikolog]

@pazam-h2
I understand your concern, and I agree that doing nothing is not necessarily the best long-term solution.

However, I am not fully convinced that Diplomacy is a mechanic that players generally overlook. In my experience, it has always been considered one of the strongest secondary skills in Heroes II. The ability to recruit neutral creatures without combat can dramatically increase a hero's power, and the main factor limiting its use is usually economy rather than the mechanic itself.

The history of Heroes III and its mods is also a good example. Diplomacy became so powerful in the hands of experienced players that mod-developers even nerfed it. While Heroes II handles Diplomacy differently, the skill remains extremely valuable and influential.

That is one of the reasons why I am cautious about exposing additional information before an encounter. Even if exact formulas and probabilities are not shown, giving players more insight into potential recruitment outcomes could indirectly strengthen an already powerful skill and reduce the importance of discovery and risk assessment.

That said, I agree with your broader point that there is still room for improvement. I simply do not think that intrusive notifications are the right direction. Until a more robust solution is found, improving the skill description seems like a safe and useful compromise.

The current description is already quite dense, but I hope this will become less of an issue once wider UI layouts are introduced through #9946. Since the vast majority of modern devices use widescreen displays, taking advantage of the additional space available is one of the benefits a modern engine such as fheroes2 can provide while still preserving the original gameplay experience.

[pazam-h2]

@Branikolog -
I tried changing the skill description to add the relevant unknown prerequisites of Diplomacy as brief as I could, and indeed it makes the UI too large for 640x480 resolution:

old:

new:

@ihhub -
What is the reason #9946 is not implemented yet?
Is there something that can be done in the matter?

[pazam-h2]

Also- what are your guys thoughts on the new text? I'll change it as what will be agreed upon.

[zenseii]

@pazam-h2 and @Branikolog. I think adding this text is the best solution. I would also change the text a little:

"... who may offer to join the army provided there is room and provided the hero has enough gold. It also reduces the cost of surrender."

This text will still be too long until dialogs like this can be widened so until that PR is done we'll wait. I suggest that we close #10826 since the final change will just be a simple text edit, or we can make the text edit in that existing PR.